Names

A quick thought about names.  Currently, Ceqli names have the form of a Ceqli morpheme or compound, plus the suffix -zo. This gives clarity, but it makes all names one extra syllable long. Now, the Loglan rule was that all names end in a consonant followed by a pause, and that kept names short. I'm beginning to wonder about that possibility. As of now, before the -zo, all Ceqli names have a falozim —a vowel, semivowel, nasal, or R or L. How about this rule:

All Ceqli names end in -t plus a pause, except when the preceding letter is q, in which case they end with -k, or when it's m, in which case the ending is -p.

We'd have names like:

Tomp Jefersont
Heybrahamp Hlinkont
Jant
Samp
Bilt
Salit
Jerit
Biqk

Or I could make it always -t, and when the preceding letter is q or m, make it -at.  Those above would be
Tomat
Heybrahamat
Samat
Biqat

An advantage to this system, either with t, k, p, or with t, -at, would be that a pause afterwards wouldn't be so crucial, as it's natural for an English speaker, at least, to make a clear disjuncture.  I mean

Jant sa
doesn't sound much like
Jan tsa
at all because the latter is a pretty clear affricate, and the former has little tendency to become one.

All that would work fine with people's names, but it gets trickier with, say, names of things.  Say:

Japant - Japan

But what about Japanese language, Japanese person, etc? Is it ambiguous or problematical to say:

Da Japantjin.  He is Japanese.
Da Japantbol. It is Japanese language.
or
Da Japanthaym. It is Japan.
or
Da Japant sa komxo. It is Japan's (Japanese) food.

With those three endings it isn't, because of course a word can't begin or end with tj, tb, or th, so the morphology still self-segregates. And the sa seems to work okay when I pronounce it.  That is, I clearly distinguish

Japant sa
Japan tsa

At this point, I'm inclined to go with -t, -p, -k.

For foreign names that remain in foreign form, like mine, Rex May, which doesn't fit Ceqli phonology at all, I can use the "article" ta, and to avoid ambiguity, close it with beta:

Go bekyam ta Rex May beta. My name is Rex May. I could also Ceqli-fy it thus:

Sreksat Smeyt

or flat-out translate it, as it means "King fifth-month," as:

Kiqot Fayzemxart

Or, taking "may" as the verb meaning having permission, which is "kuna" from Swedish:

Kiqot Kunat

More Revision

The Wiki

is up to date, and so are both glossaries there. Please point out any errors to rmay@mac.com

Revision

I'm in the process of revising the CeqliWiki. I've reverted a few things back to the original form, clarified the alphabet and pronunciation and given the letters names. I've abandoned the Loglan notion of retaining CV for grammar words and making everything else a content word. It's simply too restricting and some words, like numerals and other mathematical terms, don't fall clearly in either classification.

My next step is to prepare a dictionary, and then I'll revise Ceqli through Pictures.

P.S. I have a good start on the Ceqli-English glossary.

Phonology Change?

I just had the darnedest idea for extending the Ceqli phonology.  I've been bothered for awhile that there's no zh sound (as in 'treaSure') in it, though there's a j and both a x and a c for the sounds in SHoe and CHew.  Symmetry demands something better.  I could set j to stand for zh, and then indicate the former j sound with dj. But if I did that, symmetry demands that I drop c and use tx to make that sound. Then I'd have an extra letter, c, that would be good for nothing.  So then I thought of, not adding accented letters, which are a nightmare, but using double letters. Since double letters simply can't occur in Ceqli as it is, double letters could be regarded as letters all by themselves, opening up lots of new phonemes — not that I'd use them all in Ceqli, but they'd be handy for ZH, and also for transcribing foreign words, especially names.

So let's say zz = the sound in treaSure
Then tt = TH as in THin
dd = THere
ff = Japanese bilabial F
vv = Spanish bilabial B

You see where I'm going.

Also, vowels could double, and
aa = cAt
ee = bUt
ii = thIs
oo = German ö
uu = German ü

Again, the only thing I'd regularly use would be zz.  I'd especially like to replace ja je ji jo ju with zza, etc.

Any reactions?

Some Feedback.

From "Argle Bargle"

I'm assuming you'd like feedback on the lessons. I found a few errors in the first few lessons.

http://ceqli.pbworks.com/w/page/5455972/Lesson%202

• ...There's a remote danger that fawl pina will be heard as fawlbwa which might mean ...

I think you meant "fawl bwa"

[Fixed]

http://ceqli.pbworks.com/w/page/5455973/Lesson%203

• Names behave in the same grammatical way that pronouns do, except that when haym or bol, etc. is compounded to the end of a zo name, the whole thing becomes a name, and that behaves like a pronoun.

Did you mean to put it that way?  Summary: "names behave like pronouns, except for [condition] where they behave like pronouns."

[fixed - subbed "and" for "except for".]

Regarding the words "je, ja, ji and jo", I can't tell if it's an omission on the page or an omission in the language, but where is "or" in the sense of most western languages? "this or that, but not both."  (In computer programming terms, "ja" would be "inclusive or," but most natural languages use an "exclusive or.")

[this is amazingly confusing.  I think you'd make it out of "ji," meaning "if and only if." Thus:

Zi fey bwa biru ji vin.  You can drink beer if and only if you drink wine.

Zi fey bwa biru jibu vin.  You can drink beer if and only if you DON'T drink wine.

Logically, I think this is equivalent to:

You can drink beer or wine, but not both.

Let me know if I'm wrong.]

One broad suggestion for the lessons: define the predicates before giving examples. For example, this confused me at first:

• dasa pasa zbano.  or dasa pazbano. Her ex-husband.

"sa" hadn't been introduced yet, nor treating "da" as "her." (Though, with things changing as they have been around the world, it could be seen as ambiguous since it could also be "his ex-husband.")  The "padey, doydey, fuday" example is good, but for completeness, it would have been nice to see "dey = day" preceding it.

[I'll fix this ASAP]

Wikipedia Article

I just noticed that somebody wrote a Ceqli article for Wikipedia. It was about Ceqli as it was many years ago, so I just updated it.  It's HERE.  Let me know if you see any errors or have suggestions for improvement.

Causation

I've been worrying about "therefore" and "because."  Here's a thought.  Let "kaw" mean "cause," and "kwa" mean "be caused by."

Go kaw ke zi dorm.   I cause you to sleep.

Ke Go dorm kwa zi.  My sleeping is caused by you.

Now, suppose we let these words act as prefixes for je, "and."

Go pa don pan ko zi, kawje zi pa kom.

I gave bread to you, therefore (cause-and) you ate.

Go pa kom, kwaje zi pa don pan ko go.

I ate because (is-caused-by-and) you gave bread to me.

Then, if that all makes sense, we can use words like hum, "logic," to form more specific becauses:

Go pa kom to pan, humkawje zi bu fey kom to pan.

I ate the bread, therefore (logically-cause-and) you can't eat the bread.

Or teyqi, "definition" from Japanese.

Da fimsa jin, teyqikawje da jini.

It is a female person, therefore (definition-cause-and) it is a woman.

Other because/therefore pairs could be made with words meaning "motivation," "process," "justify," etc.

Your thoughts?  Thanks to Gleki Arxokuna for help in formulating this so far.