Re-Loglanizing the Alphabet

Going back to my original inspiration, how about I use the Loglan alphabet, slightly modified:

b, d, f, h, k, l, m, n, p, r, s, t, v, z all as in English.

c= /S/ as in SHe
therefore tc = /tS/ as in CHeese
g always as in Goat
j = /Z/ as in meaSure
therfore
dj = /dZ/ as in John
q = /N/ as in baNG

So far that's the way I had it in Tjeqli version one. Now for some differences.

Like Loglan, I and U become semivowels when next to other vowels, unless set off with a hyphen:

pia = PYAH, pi-a = PEE-ah
taulo = TOW-loh, ta-ulo = ta-OO-loh

Anybody have a better idea than using the hyphen this way? I was going to use an apostrophe, but I want to reserve that to indicate stress when necessary.

That leaves x, y, and w. X can be used as I said before as a letter modifier as in
tx= /T/. w can be schwa. What can y do?
------------
Input has convinced me that y should = schwa, which leaves w as a free letter.

Dubya

No, not that Dubya. I just had an epiphany, or something. Let's change that rule I mentioned in the last post, and say that both i and u become semivowels when next to a vowel. And if you don't want them to, use a hyphen to stop it from happening:

bua - BWAH
bu-a - BOO-ah

Skia - SKYAH
Ski-a SKEE-ah

And that liberates both y and w for other uses. So let's use w for schwa. And j can indicate the palatalization of the consonant it follows:

sj = /S/ Sji selz si sjelz bai dxw sisjor.
tj = /tS/  (so the language would be Tjeqli.)
zj = /Z/
dj = /dZ/

I know this is an alarming revision, but please don't react like Sensei does in the illustration.

I'm going to go with the revisions in this and the last post unless somebody talks me out of it.

By George She's Got It, She's Really Got It!

A correspondent writes:
Rex, is there a compact list for pronounciation, first row the letter, second row the IPA character(s)? E.g. as at https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php...

And he's right, I need to make one, for a number of reasons. But before I do, I have a question. There's the IPA, where you spell the "ch" sound that Tceqli begins with as tʃ. IPA has a bunch of characters like that stretched-out "s" that aren't readily available on your keyboard. I've seen that same sound spelled /tS/ between two slashes like that. I assume this is a system designed for people who can't, for whatever reason, make the offbeat symbols like ʃ.  Anybody know? And know what the system's called, and where I can find a link to it?

Another question. How does this sound to everybody?:

You can symbolize just about any sound you want with Tceqli's 26 letters — 25 letters that have one phoneme each associated with them, and then the X, which is used to modify the other letters, mainly for foreign sounds. 

tx = th as in THin

hx = ch as in BaCH

ux = ü as in Über

You also have the option of replacing letter-followed-by-x with any version of that letter with a diacritic of any kind:

tx > t

hx > ħ

ux > ü (of course)

But that's sophisticated stuff for the future.

And then we have schwa, which won't be a basic Tceqli sound, but which i figure will be in the names of most Tceqli lettersa; ah, buh, shuh, duh, etc.,, and of course in foreign words and names.

The same correspondent writes:

In the Unified Latin Alphabet 2016 (ULA 2016) schwa is <y>. In IPA /y/ is a vowel and using <y> as vowel, allows easy pronounciation of international words like Yttrium.

Letter <y> = IPA /j/ would then be <j> = /j/, i.e. less deviation from IPA. Beside in IPA this is used in several Germanic and Slavic languages languages.

Then Tceqli would need something for /ʒ/. ULA 2016 uses <q>.

Then Tceqli needs something for /ŋ/. Maybe use the modifier here, i.e. Tcenxli.

I really don't want to make all those changes, but y for schwa is tempting. But if y is used for that, it can't be used as the semivowel it represents in current Tceqli. For that I'd have to use j (and then represent /Z/ with a ʒ and /dZ/ with dʒ. Or just go to Russian and use ж. Or, I could replace semivowel y with a simple i, and change the rule so that i next to another vowel behaves as a semivowel.

The trouble with this last is that you can't have a word like dia pronounced DEE-ah. It would be DYAH. One way around that would be to have the i-becomes-semivowel rule, but also have a way to short-circuit it by saying that a hyphen separates vowels and causes them to be pronounced separately. So dia would be DYAH and di-a would be DEE-ah.

Do give me your input on all of this.

That = Ke or maybe Cto

I originally borrowed ke from Esperanto and several other languages to introduce a noun clause. In Loglan, the corresponding "that" is simply le (the) followed by po, which makes the le refer to the entire noun clause. So I'm thinking to follow the Loglan example to some extent, and have ke replaced by a the-word.


An ideal candidate would be the Russian что, which would come into Tceqli as cto, pronounced like the Russian. It has the advantage of looking like it was deliberately derived from to. So

Go djan, ke zi pa kom to pan.
I know, that you past eat the bread.
I know you ate the bread.
becomes
Go djan, cto zi pa kom to pan.
I know, that you past eat the bread.
I know you ate the bread.

What do you all think?

Revision

Latest revision: Do is now only the present tense particle, for it to mean 'when,' or 'at the time of,' it must be followed by 'sa.' Analogously, the same goes for pa and fu, the past and future particles, that now mean before and after when followed by 'sa.' Does anybody see any problems with this change? I could also use ke in place of sa.

More Alphabet Blather

I'm definitely eliminating c= /tS/  No way it isn't awkward.  I can use either x or c for /S/. If I use c, as do Loglan and Lojban, I'll  have x for use in modifying other letters to make foreign sounds. tx could be /T/ for example. The 26 letters just aren't enough to have special characters for both /dZ/ and /tS/.  Depending on which way I go, the language will be either Txeqli or Tceqli.  Your input is appreciated.

And, don't read anything much into the illustrations I use here. I pick them more or less at random for amusement purposes.

Asymmetry in the Alphabet

Ceqli has an alphabetical assymetry:

x = /S/
and
c=/tS/
but
j= /Z/
and
dj= /dZ/

Awkward. I want to eliminate c, reserving it for something else, and spell
/tS/ as tx, to match dj.

If I don't hear any good reasons not, I'll revise the material to reflect this soon. Don't let this shock you. Comment here, or on Facebook https://www.facebook.com/The-Ceqli-Language-249301371750083/